Porsche 911 Turbo S lap time at Sachsenring

I have watched both videos of 456Speciale and 911Turob S next to each other can someone please explain me what "kerb" is missing at the Turbo S lap? The track is absoultly identical, the only different is the camaera angle in the car... if u look and hear the 458 Speciale video he hit the curb at nearly all apax as hard as he did with the Turbo S... were the Turbo S won its slight advantage over the 458 were the uphill section were the torque simple pulled harder... the 458 was extremly tailhappy and Guido Naumann lost perhaps a little bit with the 458 specialy in the last corner to the uphill start finish straight as the 458 made a small sidestep

..Question is, What kind of impact would that make on the laptimes? I can understand repaving certain areas which could help with grip, But how much and where?

top gear track has added 3 slabs of concrete in the last 2 corners... just saying

Lol counter productive

But that does seem awfully strange

We can't add another track page just because of modification on one kerb? That would be counter-productive, I think.

It may seem like a trivial change but cutting that corner means less turning and speed loss for the second part of the double left, and any speed loss there affects the area under the v-t graph all the way down the fast flat section (fastest part of lap). Even a 5% change in speed there will cost >1s for that sector. If you add that second back on to the Turbo S time, it suddenly fits much better with the other times given tyre option.

You also have to look at how the GT3 gets within 3kph of the Huracan and 5kph of the Speciale, which did that section flawlessly. On a simply fast section, Autocar figured the Speciale 10kph faster than the GT3. A 5kph difference at near 150mph is massive.

See peak speeds at 11:23
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aODISxOHiI

I agree the laptime does stand out much more then it should considering the time, and option of tyre compared to its other laptimes, But I don't think the removal of a rumble strip calls for a different track layout, I cannot view the video at this time though.

But given the magazine, I could see some biased, but I strongly agree in reverting to that.

I merely said it was a magical kerb but, as I said below, it is disingenuous to feature an article comparing times as like-for-like, when they aren't.

I knew as soon as I looked at the tyres and the time that something was wrong, so a professional magazine must surely have noticed, not to mention the driver. On what planet does a Turbo S on ordinary PZeros beat a Huracan on Trofeo Rs?

I've also seen 12 year-olds play Gran Turismo without cutting corners as much as they did in the Turbo S.

"It appears this is a magical kerb that disappears when porsches lap"

from your own post

Kage - Where did I say that? I'm going by the 6 videos I have seen and stating exactly what's on them. But it is disingenuous to feature an article that compares lap times as like-for-like when they aren't. The driver is a regular and must have noted the impact of the change.

BR2 - Look at the kerb that is present only in the non-Porsche videos and then look how much the 911s are able to cut that corner without the kerb.

If this is a 'time' issue then it should be recorded as a circuit alteration and the Speciale, 650S and Huracan times should be moved onto a 'post-03/2014 or whenever it was changed) Sachsenring' layout.

...Here we go again.

Ps Magic is real.

I'm not arguing about the impact of the kerb on the lap times but what you are saying in your posts is that Auto Bild or someone else, removes the kerb for Porsche laps then puts them back on after. My point is the kerb is not missing it simply didn't exist back then, that is why I asked if there are any videos before Nov 2013 that show the kerb.

The 991 GT3 ran after 9th Nov 2013 (March 2014) and the kerb was also missing then. The kerb was installed and then the 911's competitors were tested.

But it doesn't matter, the missing kerb allows cars to do that sector faster and it can be seen from the data that the Turbo S should suffer on that sector as it's relatively slow from 100-200kph, and the inferior tyres and AWD should push it wider in the fast right-hander, yet it doesn't because that kerb isn't there. The driver also cuts the fast right-hander.

Watch the 458 Speciale perform that sector and tell me if you think it's fair that it only ended up with the same time?

It was also an absolute master class in corner cutting with the 911s.

All the cars that ran with a kerb should run again with the kerb removed or the 911s should run again with it in place.

Well do you have any videos made before nov 9, 2013(date of turbo S time) that show the kerb?

I'm sorry but removing a kerb from a corner at the start of the fastest flat-out section, allowing a much neater faster turn is just plain wrong.

Conspiracy or not it's invalid for comparison purposes.

@sroser
Do you walk around your house with a tinfoil hat thinking of new conspiracy theories? Maybe you should watch the videos in chronological order before writing such nonsense, or are you just waiting for every chance to trash Porsche so it doesn't threaten your precious McLarens?

Oh wait, just noticed something.

At 1:10 in Turbo S video the rumble strip has be courteously removed to allow greater corner-cutting, see same corner at 1:21 in 650S video and 1:41 in Huracan video and gone again in Turbo S Cabrio video at 1:17 and GT3 video at 1:13 (on facebook - id=756094357747652) but came back strong at 1:21 in Speciale video. Note that this kerb is right on the corner just before the fastest straight section on the track. The following left is just a lift, so the speed is carried all the way down that straight. Notice how tight a line the removal of the kerb allows.

It appears this is a magical kerb that disappears when porsches lap. Sadly I don't believe in magic, so I'm marking this time incorrect. The corner-cutting hilarity in the Turbo S video is also worthy of note.

Turbo S
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iGqybXlwN-k&feature=youtu.be

Turbo S Cabrio
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shk-7ysKBU8

650S
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfnifxiUAYY#t=124

Speciale
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lJvN5I3yDo#t=62

Huracan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgwNvHVw5IY#t=111

Very good time given that it used normal tyres.

http://www.germancarforum.com/threads/the-princes-of-sachsenring-2014-vs-the-king.52286/

"The only downside: it lose some of Porsche character, it lose on reliability."

Where the hell did you learn that stuff?..

I have to agree with Hamcee someway.. Some of your posts simply make no sense without confirming to any fact...

..Ive always found the Turbos to be quite hairy at the limit.