Porsche 911 GT3 lap time at Hockenheim GP

Image of Porsche 911 GT3

2021 Porsche 911 GT3 completed a flying lap of Hockenheim GP in 1 minute and 45.8 seconds.

Track Hockenheim GP
Type flying start
Vehicle Porsche 911 GT3 (992)
Power / weight 510 ps / 1455 kg
Driver Christian Gebhardt
Time 1:45.800
Peak speed 260 kph (162 mph)
Average speed 156 kph (97 mph)
Air temperature 8 C (46 F)
Track temperature 10 C (50 F)
Air pressure 1018 mbar
Notes Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 R tires
Submitted 07.05.2021 by Hoppelmoppel123
Source Sport Auto magazine (Germany)
Views 956

Reference:   Image of source Sport Auto - 6/2021

Sauber C351:17.12-28.7
McLaren Senna (P15)1:40.79-5.0
AMG GT Black Series1:43.30-2.5
McLaren 720S1:45.50-0.3
Porsche 911 GT31:45.80
Ferrari 488 Pista1:45.90+0.1
McLaren 765LT1:46.20+0.4
Aventador SVJ1:47.30+1.5
Porsche 718 GT4 RS1:47.60+1.8
BMW M8 Competition264+4.0
Huracán STO263+3.0
BMW M5 CS263+3.0
Porsche 911 Turbo 262+2.0
Porsche 911 GT3 (992)260 kph
AMG GT 63 S259-1.0
911 GT3 Touring258-2.0
BMW M8 Competition258-2.0
Streetfighter V4 S257-2.8
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dr. cosimo  1y ago

here is a closer look at the fake vents of the vw-911 cheating-3 lol

0b6ae25a258a.jpg?550x800m


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Cocobe  1y ago

Several factors for why this laptime was so good. air temperature was definitely good. But tbh, largest factor was, track limits.
Turn 1, the Porsche definitely went much wider and the minimum speed 152kph. In comparison the Pista stayed within the limits and had a minimum speed of 132kph. Just the part between turn 1 and turn 2, the Porsche would have gained about 0.4s.

FIA rules did somewhat change, where the track limit is no longer the white lines, but as long as the inside wheel is still on the curb, it's considered legal. That alone would give newer lap times a huge advantage. But I'm sorry, that first corner is still definitely off track. Really should not have counted.

Elsewhere you see the car being driven to the edges of the track on every occasion, (which is what you should do). While the Pista took some corners with a more tightly and straightening out the steering wheel sooner, as oppose to taking a wider sweep approach.

This explains a lot of why the car was so "fast" on the track, at least compared to the other 700hp cars.


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Freakz  1y ago

911 GT3 (992) Hockenheim GP lap:

 


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Corvolet3  1y ago

And people call me crazy when I say Porsche is using modified press cars. The whole track consists of long straights and a minimum of turns, yet the car somehow manages to be faster than a significantly more powerful 488 Pista.

Even if you're a hardcore Porsche fanboy, at this point you should admit they're just cheating on tracks.

 

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CarCritic  1y ago

German car, German track...

you-smart.jpg?550x800m


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SpeedKing  1y ago

Out of curiosity what type of modifications do you believe Porsche have made on their press cars ?


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Corvolet3  1y ago @SpeedKing

I have no idea actually. Same with the fact how it's supposed to be only 20kph slower than 700 hp cars on a straight line! But as you know Porsche, they probably squeezed some power out of the engine again.


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Hoppelmoppel123  1y ago @Corvolet3

It probably doesnt have more than 530 ps


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SpeedKing  1y ago @Corvolet3

Comparing the 2022 GT3 vs 2018 GT3RS acceleration at the Nurb, both factory cars with factory drivers, the new GT3 accelerates as quickly as the GT3RS so from what i've seen the new GT3 is basically the GT3RS in disguise.


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Corvolet3  1y ago @SpeedKing

Again: what N/A car with 500 hp accelerates as fast as a turbocharged 700 hp? The Pista does 0-200 in less than 7.8 while the GT3 struggles to get under 11, which is comparable to a BMW M5. In what world could it actually make up for this lack of power? Not to mention the old GT3 RS was equally fast on a track like a Shelby GT500 which SOMEHOW is 9 seconds slower here despite it having a huge advantage on a straight line.

Sport auto is spouting bullshit, just admit it.


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SpeedKing  1y ago @Corvolet3

It obviously doesn't accelerate as fast as the Pista or any other 700hp car. What the GT3 does is brake later and negotiate corners faster which is where it makes up time for the slower acceleration. Anyway i'm not here to defend Porsche lol


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SpeedKing  1y ago @Corvolet3

Remember when Chris Harris compared the Senna against a GT3 car at Silverstone which had 550hp ie. at least 250hp less than the Senna. Sure the GT3 car had slicks which would give it a 3-4 sec advantage over the TrofeoR's per lap but even so the Cup car was 7 sec faster overall. Reason being it brakes later and is much faster into, around and out of corners even though it's much slower than the Senna in a straight line. Power is not the be all and end all :)

 


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Corvolet3  1y ago @SpeedKing

Yet it's still unrealistic how a 500 hp car can beat a 700 hp car. There's literally no way the GT3 can make up so much time in the last 5-6 corners before the track ends when it has been gapped by a train length. Then again sport auto tends to let Porsche win in their tests, so it doesn't surprise me.

As for the Senna, this has to be a joke. It's literally the closest thing to a street legal race car and you wanna tell me it's overall slower than a GT3? No offense, but you lost your mind.


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Anonymous  1y ago @Corvolet3

Post content redacted by Advanced BS Detector (ABSD)™


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SpeedKing  1y ago @Corvolet3

Lol of course the Senna is faster than a GT3 road car but my point which you're unable to accept is that even with 250hp less a GT3 cup car can still destroy a Senna on track so your comments referring to a 530hp car beating a 700hp on track being unrealistic is actually not the case if the 530hp car has got superior handling.


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Corvolet3  1y ago @SpeedKing

Ohh, my bad. I didn't watch the video an thought you compared the Senna to the 911 GT3. But my point still stands. Why are you comparing a road illegal car to a legal one? They have a completely different setup, and obviously the cup car is gonna stomp it in corners. But after that logic you might as well compare it to a 300 hp race bike which will destroy both. Don't compare apples with oranges!!!


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SpeedKing  1y ago @Corvolet3

Oh come now the difference between the new GT3(basically GT3RS) and the GT3 Cup is no longer worlds apart. Obviously the GT3 Cup is about 200 kilos lighter and has much greater downforce with stickier tyres but the suspension components and brakes are much closer now than ever before which is why the road cars are so bloody fast on track and give the 700hp cars a run for their money :)


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Corvolet3  1y ago @SpeedKing

LOL sure, no difference. You said yourself a while ago that there are at least 20 seconds of difference on the Burger Ring between the cup and the road car. Why don't you also take the Corvette C6 Z06 and compare it to the C6.R while we're at it?


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SpeedKing  1y ago @Corvolet3

Hey i've tried to open your eyes to what's possible but they remain glued shut lol btw where the fcuk did i say there was no difference?


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Corvolet3  1y ago @SpeedKing

-Oh come now the difference between the new GT3(basically GT3RS) and the GT3 Cup is no longer worlds apart

-says something about 20 seconds of difference at the Nürburgring which is A LOT and still worlds apart

Mate, stick to your logic and stop contradicting yourself. At the end of the day road legal cars are still far away from race cars so it's just fair to say Porschd cheated yet again. i mean, that's what they're known for. Especially sport auto drives international cars much worse on their track for some reason.

I'll just stop arguing with you, you have literally nothing of value to say and just try to troll me at this point. We already have enough clueless people in the car community.


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SpeedKing  1y ago @Corvolet3

Me clueless lol now that is the pot calling the kettle black. Everything i've said is accurate but you obviously don't have the mental acuity to comprehend logic..


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196ss  1y ago @Corvolet3

In general, it's not necessary for a 700-horsepower car to be faster on the track than a 500-horsepower car.
But in this case, I think you're right, in equal conditions, Pista should be faster at Hockenheim. If we look at the comparison sheet between 991.2GT3RS (it is mostly the same car as 992GT3) and Pista, then we will see that Porsche is faster only on Anneau du Rhin and Tazio Nuvolari, which are very curvy, on the rest of the tracks 911 is hopelessly behind.
https://fastestlaps.com/comparisons/6iti3ion3zgf

Although I don't think it's a cheating from Porsche, it's just that Sport Auto didn't try hard enough with the Pista. In reality, they could get a time of 1:43-1:44, at least they surely could be faster than 720.


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196ss  1y ago @SpeedKing

McLaren claims that Senna GTR is faster than every other McLaren racecar except Formula 1.
So I suppose base Senna on slicks and GT3 racecar should be close.


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Corvolet3  1y ago @196ss

Yeah, that's the thing that bugs me: they were both driven in the same conditions (no Porsche factory driver who knows his GT3 like his wallet), and on this GP track the Pista has too many advantages for the Porsche to make up time in the few corners the track actually has.

All these incredible Porsche laptimes probably just grew old to me so I get grumpy when I just hear about them, especially when it's a sport auto or Nürburgring time which can hardly be redone by a non-expert. Not to offend anyone, I just turn a little emotional when I have to listen to the same story over and over again.

The Pista as well as the 720S should actually have the upper hand I agree. Mostly powerful cars (even 4 door sedans) are incredibly fast in comparison due to these long straights.


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Corvolet3  1y ago @SpeedKing

I admit that wasn't right or appropriate of me to call you that. I'm not always on the right track in car discussions and get a little impulsive when an argument has been going on for too long, but nonetheless I want to apologize for my statement. And from what I've seen on this website, you sure know your stuff better than me :) just to put this out of the way.


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SpeedKing  1y ago @Corvolet3

Your apology is appreciated and yes i do understand why peeps get passionate particularly when they believe they're right. The thing i've learnt over decades is that sometimes what appears impossible or unlikely can actually happen in some cases. The problem with tests by SportAuto or any other mag is that we don't know the fine details eg. weather conditions, whether the tyres were new or used. The other thing with Gebhardt is that he's no doubt very familiar with Porsche cars whereas he's had little experience with Ferrari's and Lambo's so that suggests that he's not gonna be as quick in those cars. So these are the factors that will make a difference rather than cheating per se...


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SpeedKing  1y ago @Corvolet3

Just to highlight the difference that worn tyres can have on track you only need to look at Tommy Maino's lap in the Pista on shot Cup2's at Tazio Nuvalori which is a tight track. With fresh Cup2's a high 1:23 lap should be possible.

 


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Cocobe  1y ago @196ss

First of all, the Senna GTR has 200kg more downforce.
The road going Senna can't wear slicks because its suspension and components weren't designed for such g-forces.
The Senna tires are 245 and 315, while the Senna GTR is 285 325.

for reference, a 650s GT3 car has 315 and 335 tires.

Even with slick tires, the regular Senna still has 30% less front grip than the race car. Turn in and braking will be a huge disadvantage.


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196ss  1y ago @Cocobe

"The road going Senna can't wear slicks because its suspension and components weren't designed for such g-forces."

Oh, really?
Why then usual 911 GT3 after installing slicks, immediately goes 2-3% faster?

I’m aware that Senna GTR tires are wider than the base one. When I spoke about Senna on slicks, I meant the dimension of the tires like Senna GTR. Sorry for not clarifying this in my comment.
It is clear that even on the same tires, Senna GTR will be faster. The question is – by how much? I estimate that +25 hp, -10 kg, slightly increased downforce, and a re-tuned suspension should increase the average lap speed by about 4-5%. Given that the Senna GTR is supposed to be more productive on the track than the 720S GT3, which in turn is faster than the 650S GT3, the difference between the basic Senna on slicks and the 650S GT3, in my opinion, shouldn’t be big. Nonetheless it depends on the specific circuit surely.
As far as I could understand from Chris Harris comments on the video above, the main problem that prevented him from making a good laptime with Senna was the lack of grip on the front axle during braking and cornering. In theory, wide slicks should correct this shortcoming.


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Cocobe  1y ago @196ss

not being able to wear slicks is what Mclaren said.

The Senna GTR tires wouldn't fit on the Senna either. Mclaren claims that had they installed bigger tires on the road going senna, it would have to give up downforce and aero balance, since the tires will eat into the floor space and tunnels.

The Senna GTR body and chassis is quite different.

The Senna GTR was the fastest Mclaren outside of Formula 1. Not sure now, since there is the 720s GT3x now, a full blown gt3 race car that has 200 more hp, less weight, more aero as well as another 30hp on tap for push to pass.


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196ss  1y ago @Cocobe

Interesting, didn't know that Senna and Senna GTR are so much different in design.


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Cauf40f50  1w ago

ip 145.80.992.70


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V10  1y ago

Wow, better time in worse conditions than Pista